Sorry, Scoble, Quora is not your playground
January 30, 2011 § 86 Comments
By: Dan Kaplan
“This used to be my playground. This used to be my childhood dream. This used be the place I ran to…whenever I was in need.” -Madonna
So Robert Scoble, it seems you don’t like the heat. In the bygone days of what feels like ten minutes ago, you, the ubiquitous tech evangelist, larger-than-life personality and Rackspace blogger, couldn’t stop gushing about how great Quora was. Was Quora, you asked in the halcyon age of last December, the biggest blogging innovation in 10 years? Of course it was. Back in them days and throughout January, you could post answers to a wide range of questions and your ardent Twitter followers could upvote them en masse and each upvote and congratulatory comment could generate that awesome squirt of dopamine in your brain. And wasn’t it grand?
But, my, how quickly things can change.
This morning, after seeing some of your favored Quora answers down-voted into oblivion and experiencing the anonymous sting of an overzealous reviewer, you decided to lash out. Quora, you wrote, was “a horrid service for blogging.” Sure, you said, “it’s fine for a QA site, but we have lots of those.” As if to administer a finishing move, you added that Quora’s competitors are actually bigger and better and badder – especially Stack Exchange, where “the answers are broader in reach and deeper in quality.”
Well, sorry, Scoble, Quora is not your playground.
You see, back in the way-back days for Quora, around the time you wrote the site off as just another “damn thing on the internet,” the community/reviewer/admin nexus was quite good at ensuring that the highest quality answers were the ones at the top. But when you decided that Quora would actually be an excellent place to exercise your influence, the Scoble Effect kicked in. And while the Scoble Effect can be a wonderful thing for a startup – see Flipboard – in a finely balanced ecosystem like Quora’s, it has landed like a Category 5 hurricane.
This is not really your fault: Quora’s auto-follow logic was not built for edge cases like yours – cases that have 125K+ followers attached to their social graphs. The logic that made early Quora’s on-boarding experience so effective has transformed your Twitter army into your Quora horde. And this horde has been rampaging like a bunch of 12th Century Mongolians.
These raiders, insensitive to the cultural norms of the civilization they are pillaging, give you up-votes despite your fluffy rambling, despite the showy photos and links to yourself that you stuff into your answers, despite the names you drop with catastrophic aplomb. They vote up your shit because that’s what hordes do when they are yours.
The consequence has been a number of prominent questions where your answers rise to the top, leaving the objectively more sophisticated answers languishing below the fold.
Well, Robert, no civilization likes to be raided by Mongols. On a long enough horizon, its constituents will develop better defenses, build bigger alliances and do what they can to mitigate the damage from the raids.
Sometimes, in the rush to combat the chaos, a reviewer or two will get out of line. And the fact that he or she can anonymously shut down a popular answer with no clear means of recourse is surely unfair. But Quora is young, yet, and the minds behind the site are hard at work designing a salve for its growing pains.
Until the salve can be applied, I implore you: tame your ego, chill out with the fluffed-up rambles, the pointless photos and the naked self-aggrandizement. Exercise restraint. You may find that the community will stop treating you as a hostile Khan, stalking its frontiers from the Social Media Steppe. It may even come to embrace your presence, sending you up-votes as tribute for your newly peaceful disposition and the positive parts of the Scoble Effect.
Dan Kaplan is a Quora aficionado. You should follow Dan on Quora.
Sorry, Scoble, Quora is not your playground…
“This used to be my playground. This used to my childhood dream. This used be the place I ran to…whenever I was in need.” -Madonna. So Robert Scoble, it seems you don’t like the heat. In the bygone days of what feels like ten minutes ago, you, the…
[…] and the positive attention your bring to the site.This post was cross-posted from The Quora Review (https://quorareview.com/2011/01/3…)Suggest EditsSuggest edits to the author of this […]
Its amazing how you summed up the “Oh everyone is voting me down… this is a reall bad service” that i saw in Scoble rant… with the horde metaphore that i will start using right now😛
Turned out it wasn’t the crowd that was downvoting me, it was a small number of reviewers who were voting my answers as “not helpful.” Other reviewers have now taken away that censorship. There are definitely some problems here that need to be looked at.
Robert, you know this.
it happens all the time and you know that🙂
It happened on Digg, on Meneame (Spanish Digg), Slashdot, etc… the ¿hardcore? group of participants moves as a small crowd and have a huge impact on topics as they move in pack🙂
regards
Reminiscent of the Friendfeed conversation… I. See what you’re Saying but all I hear is Robert blah blah blahing…
By saying ‘small number of reviewers’ you still make the implication that it was some sort of cabal colluding against you.
Robert, it was one reviewer who collapsed the answer, and even that might have been to some extent a mistake. I say mistake because your original answer wasn’t as good as your edited answer and the reviewer may not have yet returned to uncollapse your answer after the edits. Of course they could also forget to uncollapse it, being human.
Also, the collapse was reversed by a single administrator.
Reviewers do not have the power to uncollapse answers that have been collapsed. The moderation system is a bit complex and needs a lot of work, such things are certainly on the mind of the Quora team.
…waits 4 the *Dan Vs Robert* DDoSing-like responses…
-mez
I answered with a new post over on my blog at http://scobleizer.com called “the Mistakes I made on Quora.”
Amazed that anyone still listens to Scoble. Gave up trying to decipher the little signalbfrom all his noise a long time ago.
You should have warned us.
Is he the guy who used to work for Microsoft?
[…] This post was cross-posted from The Quora Review (https://quorareview.com/2011/01/3…😉 […]
[…] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Erick Schonfeld, Mathew Ingram, David J. Neff, Derek Phillips, Steffen Rusten and others. Steffen Rusten said: "So Robert Scoble, it seems you don’t like the heat" | Sorry, Scoble, Quora is not your playground http://j.mp/hISjqh //via @loic […]
“These raiders, insensitive to the cultural norms of the civilization they are pillaging”
welcome to the wonderful world of User Generated Content.
“Welcome to the wonderful world of User Generated Content.”
It’s true. Don’t even get the monks started on that Gutenberg guy… After he came along, you didn’t even need to buy vellum or learn calligraphy to get published! What a vulgarian!
extra points for the madonna reference.
“leaving the objectively more sophisticated answers languishing below the fold.”
“objectively more sophisticated” LOL!
In specific response to the author’s comments:
“This is not really your fault: Quora’s auto-follow logic was not built for edge cases like yours – cases that have 125K+ followers attached to their social graphs. The logic that made early Quora’s on-boarding experience so effective has transformed your Twitter army into your Quora horde. And this horde has been rampaging like a bunch of 12th Century Mongolians.”
If Quora’s underlying software, website, or auto-follow logic-programming cannot handle users like Robert Scoble who have a greater than average (though, not the largest) followers group, don’t roll the product out. It’s either ready for meet the breakneck paced environment and people’s technology expectations, or it’s not. Benefiting from The Scoble Effect” was likely fine (maybe loved) while Quora’s current UI/UX flaws weren’t being highlighted by many users (tech leaders, tech press and just plain “users”). Now that Scoble accepts others point’s of view and tempering his (sometimes overly) enthusiastic opinion, he’s a “Mongol” or his followers a “horde“? Characterizations like that only discredit your argument and by association with Quora, discredit Quora.
I’m a Scoble follower, joined Quora based on input from many people, including reading Robert Scoble’s impressions. I found Quora to be neat, full of potential, but also, like many, lacking good initial user guidance, orientation, “how to get started”, or even “this is how you should behave”.
To support my position, I’d point you to feedback from people like @markwschaefer and an article that he wrote on his blog which is well respected by many in the marketing community, specific post at http://www.businessesgrow.com/2011/01/14/lets-not-have-a-quor-gasm/ You may note well that the commenters to that post don’t seem converse in any Mongol dialect or act like a horde, ignorant, or otherwise. They have genuine questions about Quora, it’s interface and it’s true value.
Until the salve can be applied, I implore you: tame your ego, chill out with the fluffed-up rambles, the pointless photos and the naked self-aggrandizement.
I have to wonder if writing such an inflammatory post such as author has Dan Kaplan has written is the real “self-aggrandizement.
> lacking good initial user guidance,
It took mere days for the team to set up many systems to explain Quora to newcomers—initiatives that Scoble heavily criticised as condescending. This was to *supplement* the fact that the first page a newcomer see is called Quora Guidelines.
> such an inflammatory post such as author has Dan Kaplan has written is the real “self-aggrandizement
Dan has written what Yishan answered to Scoble on Quora several times, what I commented on his blog post, what every of the 50 most active users has expressed.
To sum it up : Scoble is an attention whore, always has been, always will.
[…] Read more here Posted in Uncategorized , interesting, science, tech | No Comments » […]
How quickly Scoble flipped on Quora is yet another example of how fickle and shallow the early adopter set can be with these services.
If the Quora bitching has begun, can you imagine what it’s going to sound like when the celebrities start circling it?
Common… Scoble’s job is to hop from service to service, looking for the “next new thing”. His fan are thrill seekers and have a very short attention span.
Conclusion: Scoble did help Quora’s rise and now he is off to something else. That’s OK.
Scoble also helped Quora get slammed with fickle users, and is now stuck with their destruction.
You’re an idiot.
Quora is a bunch of little children running around playing camp advisor.
Scoble’s just figured it out before the rest of you.
Quora is a bunch of little children running around playing camp advisor.
Scoble’s just figured it out before the rest of you.
this is quite stupid. laughing but just not right.
That’s gonna leave a mark. Scoble won’t be able to contain himself now. He will obsess about having the last word
Dan Kaplan hit the nail on the head. I was at TC Disrupt and watched him during lunch. I did so because i first confused him with philip seymour hoffman, but then realized I was wrong. Anyway, I’m pretty good at reading people and I got this overwhelming impression, “wow, who is that guy? He’s an incredible douche.” I looked him up and by all accounts he seemed to confirm what I already intuitively knew. I read his rant before reading yours and it’s nice to see others can see through his frothing bullshit.
I think that Jim’s comment is mainly about Scoble, despite the fact that its first two words are “Dan Kaplan.”
I think that this is a superficial analysis of Scoble’s criticisms. It’s a lot more than just “my answers are getting downvoted.” What he’s talking about is a certain culture that has been created on the service and an ambiguity that exists when your contributions are changed or removed from the site.
This actually probably applies to a lot more “regular” people than it does to him, who don’t have the same name recognition as him, and thus are more likely to fall under the unpredictable whim of the moderators there. These are criticisms that have long been put forth by users on the site – he is just the most public person to have echoed them.
Too much of the criticism against his criticism is ad hominem – he has some real points that Quora needs to address before they further damage its potential.
you just made my day🙂
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[…] But this weekend kicked things up another notch. And naturally, it was Robert Scoble who was the catalyst. Scoble wrote a post today entitled, Why I was wrong about Quora as a blogging service … If you haven’t read it yet, you should, if only to get context for Dan Kaplan’s hilarious rebuttal. […]
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I am wondering if something else is in the Scoble MIX?
Certainly other super egos, Jason Calacanis, etc did not have a problem with Quora..
But than again name 20 firms that were bigger after Scoble named them , 20 years later..and you only have to come up with 19 if you count Microsoft..
[…] if Scoble gets pissy about it. CrunchBase Information Quora Robert Scoble Information provided by […]
[…] But this weekend kicked things up another notch. And naturally, it was Robert Scoble who was the catalyst. Scoble wrote a post today entitled, Why I was wrong about Quora as a blogging service … If you haven’t read it yet, you should, if only to get context for Dan Kaplan’s hilarious rebuttal. […]
[…] I woke up early in Davos, Switzerland, excited to go skiing, and look at Techmeme and see that the Quora Reviewer has written a post which could be titled “Scoble stay off the Quora […]
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[…] I woke up early in Davos, Switzerland, excited to go skiing, and look at Techmeme and see that the Quora Reviewer has written a post which could be titled “Scoble stay off the Quora […]
[…] I woke up early in Davos, Switzerland, excited to go skiing, and look at Techmeme and see that the Quora Reviewer has written a post which could be titled “Scoble stay off the Quora […]
If Quora were a blogging service, I would think it would make sense to use your own service for a blog rather than host it elsewhere.
The very existence of this blog kind of calls that contention into question.
At least you know what Scoble’s positions are rather than being at the mercy of a bunch of anonymous playground experts.
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Bra-fucking-vo, Mr. Kaplan, for shining the light where other bloggers and entrepreneurs fear to shine it – on the perpetually harmful self-indulgent weight that Scoble and his minions swing throughout the web. If you want your product to be taken seriously by (real) influencers, investors and the users that make it what it is, do what you can to blacklist Mr. Scoble. Otherwise, prepare for scorched earth tactics like what we saw from him yesterday.
[…] I woke up early in Davos, Switzerland, excited to go skiing, and look at Techmeme and see that the Quora Reviewer has written a post which could be titled “Scoble stay off the Quora […]
Some disclosure:
– First, while I think Robert Scoble is an entertaining read (and thus recommend his blog), I am certainly neither a fan nor a minion.
– Second, his writing about Quora convinced me to start using the service
– Third, after a brief fury of activity, Quora has joined the ranks of ‘services I have an account on but never use’.
At its
Stupid iPhone/fat finger-itis – I accidentally posted this without finishing it. I was going to write:
At its core, Quora is a whole lot like the Usenet that I originally cut my teeth on. Sad how such a tremendously good idea can completely omit any concept of community building. The site has an obsessive focus on etiquette, which is odd considering that the site’s etiquette seems to come from the powers that be. At least with Usenet, the etiquette grew organically out of the communities in question.
Seeing the mods jump all over Robert Scoble smacks of bullying and frankly, I have difficulty supporting a company that does that. The man raised some very good problems with your service – you should thank him instead of chastising him.
Frankly, I wouldn’t consider myself a fan of Robert Scoble, but I found a striking amount of value in his responses. Some of the things he wrote were truly stunning and any fan of techno-lore should be glad to have the opportunity to read him.
This is the web folks – the web is an organic mess of applied chaos. You cannot impose a set of etiquette upon a group that does not wish to abide by that etiquette. This sad episode convinces me that Quora is yet another tired fad…
[…] this morning when Robert found himself on the losing end of a drama surrounding Quora. Quora is a new Questions and Answers service that allows users to ask questions […]
[…] is or isn’t awesome and is or isn’t a blogging service. Then it just degenerated into how everyone hates Robert Scoble… which is really just what happens to every web […]
[…] それがScobleにとって不愉快かどうかは無関係だ。 CrunchBase Information Quora Robert Scoble Information provided by CrunchBase […]
[…] Sorry, Scoble, Quora is not your playground “This used to be my playground. This used to be my childhood dream. This used be the place I ran to…whenever I was in […] […]
[…] in 10 years to “Why I was wrong about Quora as a blogging service” to being given a good intervention to finally admitting he gamed the service like a one man narcissistic content farm and that’s […]
[…] innovation in 10 years to “Why I was wrong about Quora as a blogging service” to being given a good intervention to finally admitting he gamed the service like a one man narcissistic content farm and that’s why […]
[…] if Scoble gets pissy about […]
[…] But this weekend kicked things up another notch. And naturally, it was Robert Scoble who was the catalyst. Scoble wrote a post today entitled, Why I was wrong about Quora as a blogging service … If you haven’t read it yet, you should, if only to get context for Dan Kaplan’s hilarious rebuttal. […]
[…] started during the holiday season. It’s also interesting to note the drop in traffic preceded recent criticism and squabbles about Quora from that same Silicon Valley influencer community. Arguably the debates have given the site small, […]
Umm your reply is cut off after the words *small*. What was the rest of it?
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[…] Quora was a “hit” and didnt prefer the Scoble Effect anymore. Someone wrote a blog post (click) about “Scoble hoards” dominating the system. Interestingly about that time Scoble took […]
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These Q and A forums all over have slowly became tools of censorship which I blame questioning 9/11 and Obamacare on.
People who critic the left will be the first to have the thought police on them and then the rest happens depending on whatever mood they are in who push buttons.
Even YA when they went to the new purple format is not fun to even read and most of the good stuff is from several years ago.
Go to ATS and GLP forums and type in TAVISTOCK in any way or form and see how far you’ll get before being censored.
Too many people on Quora and other Q and A forums questioned 9/11 too much and the police state that Bush and Obama administered and still installing in our face because they know Americans are too braindead into entertainment to give a rat’s ass.